ASHLEY GILBERTSON - PART 2

INTERVIEW BY ROCCO CASTORO



You must have learned how to dodge bullets somewhere along the line.

Click here for more of Ashley's work.

No, it’s just been luck. But I’ve had two mentors who taught me a lot: Emmanuel Santos, who was all about the philosophy of humanity, and Masao Endo. He’s a very old-school Japanese war photographer. His first war was Vietnam—he went out on a patrol with 40 men and only three of them came back alive. He came back from that trip and spent two years freaking out in a Zen monastery because his parents couldn’t afford a shrink. He has since covered every major conflict and still does to this day even though he’s over 60. He’s a descendant of a shogun and his philosophy on photography follows what a samurai believes about war and swordsmanship. It sounds weird and far-fetched but it translates into photography so easily. You have to become so familiar with your camera that it actually becomes an extension of you. It becomes part of your nature. Masao taught me that if you’re caught in a minefield you should stick to the trees because mines can’t be planted near roots. He also told me that when you’re standing near the front line you always squat, even if all the soldiers and photographers are standing up and laughing at you. It’s one less sniper target. You have to be a little crazy to be in a situation like that in the first place, but it’s still important to take only calculated risks.

Is it possible to be unbiased when you’re worrying about being blown to tiny pieces every 30 seconds?

I have no belief in objectivity whatsoever. It’s impossible for me not to care or to withhold my emotions. When I see American administrators making decisions in Baghdad it makes me furious and I will go out and take pictures that specifically show how absolutely fucked the country is. Perhaps we would have greater change if more photographers were subjective.

In the first couple years of the war, the media and government made a big deal about embedded journalists. I never really understood how you could be anything else.

Yeah, there are these independent, unembedded journalists who think they’re nonmainstream or whatever. I’d just like to say to each one of them: Go fuck yourself. It’s bullshit. Photographers have always been embedded with their subjects. The only difference is that now the Pentagon has come up with an ugly name for it.

Have you been desensitized to violence?

I think I was when I got back home for the first time. In 2004 I spent six months in Iraq, ending with the Fallujah campaign. When I got back to New York I was totally desensitized to anyone who hadn’t been in Iraq—you did not deserve my empathy if you weren’t an Iraqi soldier or civilian or you weren’t over there for some reason. But that was totally wrong. I had to consciously force myself to start reconnecting to societies other than Iraq. By distancing myself from normal society I was cheating the Iraqis because I was forgetting I had what they wanted.



Is there something addictive about the kind of work that you do?

I think early in 2003 and maybe even part of 2004 there was an adrenaline rush that came from working in situations like I was. There is a certain feeling of invincibility when you run across a street and you’re the guy who doesn’t get hit. It gives you a lot of energy and your brain is running in survival mode. There is something very driving about that, but the adrenaline that used to be exciting now functions like a warning trigger. It’s really weird, and now if I’m doing something daring like hanging off a train in Australia instead of riding inside I will freak out in a bad way. I’ll have problems with what’s going on inside my head. When the adrenaline starts pumping it doesn’t relate to anything fun or exciting anymore. My reflex is, “Fuck, I need to get out of here and find cover.” It’s like my brain has rewired itself.

Are you going back anytime soon?

I’m headed back to Iraq through August for the end of the surge. The military is trying to make it seem like it’s some minor thing, but in fact it’s a withdrawal of 30,000 troops from Baghdad. That could go badly. I hope I’ll return without any pictures because that would be an indication of a peaceful transition—that the Iraqi Army can handle what the Americans have been doing and that sectarian violence will not spike. But if I had to guess, I would say I will be coming back with a lot of images.


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